Ask a Naval Aircrewman

[coopdeville]

So I'm in the middle of filling out my paperwork for enlisting in the Navy. I've been looking into a CT rate but my recruiter said with cutbacks it could be a six month wait till an AD slot even opens up. He suggested I look into an AIRR contract. Would I go down to MEPS, pick a different rate and do my PST? then get thrown into the lottery to get picked up?

I would love to do this but since I have a family I'm worried I'll be gone all the time once I get through the training. I am 28, married with kids.

After training, do they choose what rate you'll be doing? I would love to be an AWR but then again, I wouldn't complain about any of the other rates if I ended up there.


I'm in decent shape but does anyone have a training regiment they can post?

Thanks!

[kforbs126]

Originally Posted by coopdeville

So I'm in the middle of filling out my paperwork for enlisting in the Navy. I've been looking into a CT rate but my recruiter said with cutbacks it could be a six month wait till an AD slot even opens up. He suggested I look into an AIRR contract. Would I go down to MEPS, pick a different rate and do my PST? then get thrown into the lottery to get picked up?

I would love to do this but since I have a family I'm worried I'll be gone all the time once I get through the training. I am 28, married with kids.

After training, do they choose what rate you'll be doing? I would love to be an AWR but then again, I wouldn't complain about any of the other rates if I ended up there.


I'm in decent shape but does anyone have a training regiment they can post?

Thanks!

No matter what job you choose you'll probably be gone pretty often if you are on sea duty.

[coopdeville]

Originally Posted by kforbs126

No matter what job you choose you'll probably be gone pretty often if you are on sea duty.

I figured as much, but the research I've done it seems some rates are even gone a lot on shore duty. I was just trying to get a scope on how often AW guys are gone in either capacity.

When you say gone pretty often is that 6 months out of the year or 3 months or does it vary?

[kforbs126]

Originally Posted by coopdeville

I figured as much, but the research I've done it seems some rates are even gone a lot on shore duty. I was just trying to get a scope on how often AW guys are gone in either capacity.

When you say gone pretty often is that 6 months out of the year or 3 months or does it vary?

Ships are doing 8 to 10 month deployments. You do work ups before hand that usually combine equal 4 to 6 months being out to sea. They have a new rotation where you come back from deployment then go out on another one 6 months later.

[Haasino]

Originally Posted by coopdeville

I figured as much, but the research I've done it seems some rates are even gone a lot on shore duty. I was just trying to get a scope on how often AW guys are gone in either capacity.

When you say gone pretty often is that 6 months out of the year or 3 months or does it vary?

Yeah, helo guys deploy with ships and follow their deployment cycles... it can be more time away than the fixed-wing guys due to work-ups. Fixed-wing guys still have relatively set cycles of 6 months deployed and 12-18 months home... but that can be extended as needed.

As far as getting AWR, it's up to needs of the Navy and what the instructors choose to give you at the end of Rescue Swimmer School.

[oly077]

I'm not sure if you are married or have children, but do you have any advice, words of encouragement or caution, or need to know information for the spouse of someone headed towards A School and potentially a career in the AWO rating?

[squid.life]

Any info on what to expect for this? I'll be reporting to Whidbey island after training since I live in the Seattle area. I'm guessing a year from home for boot camp and training time. That sound right? And do we do SERE school?

[Haasino]

Originally Posted by RANDMARIE

Ok so I'm kind of freaking out, I ship to basic next Tuesday as AIRC which I'm pretty excited about but I have a few concerns. My husband is currently at selection for the Green Berets, I haven't had contact with him, and he gets home friday after I leave so it's been a while since I've seen him and obviously going to be a little while longer til I do. My question is about taking leave while going through the pipeline. I graduate basic the week before thanksgiving, so I'm not sure if I could take leave for that. Also how often can I take leave, if I have it, throughout school. Are they pretty cool about letting you leave on weekends, holidays, etc. or am I basically stuck there my whole pipeline?

Probably not for Thanksgiving... but you will be able to take about 16-18 days of leave over Christmas/New Years which'll happen while you're at NACCS. This is known as Holiday Stand-down and happens at most training commands... so if you're in training long enough you might get to take it twice like I did. Other than that, you're generally not going to be allowed to take leave once you're actually in class... some commands may let you take leave if you're on hold waiting to class-up, however. As far as weekends go, you're going to have to be Phase III in Pensacola in order to stay out overnight... and you'll need to sign out with a liberty buddy. You'll also be limited to how far from base you can travel... I think it was 75-100miles or thereabouts.

Originally Posted by squid.life

Any info on what to expect for this? I'll be reporting to Whidbey island after training since I live in the Seattle area. I'm guessing a year from home for boot camp and training time. That sound right? And do we do SERE school?

Yeah, you'll be going to VR-61 as an AWF on the C-40 Clipper... unless the moons align and you get one of the ultra-rare reserve AWO billets and go to VP-69. You won't be going to SERE as an AWF... you will if you get AWO. And, yes... I'd say about a year is a fair assumption... maybe 1.5 if you end up waiting for a while to class-up at NACCS or A School.

[RANDMARIE]

Ok so there is a chance a reservist doesn't have to be a damn flight attendant? That just sounds awful. And there's a chance a reservist can go to SERE? I was pretty excited about that part.

[Haasino]

Originally Posted by RANDMARIE

Ok so there is a chance a reservist doesn't have to be a damn flight attendant? That just sounds awful. And there's a chance a reservist can go to SERE? I was pretty excited about that part.

Are you Full Time Support, or one-weekend-a-month Reserve? From my experience, only FTS AWF's have been given C-130 orders... and even that was rare for them. The rest went to C-40 or C-12 squadrons... you'll do loadmaster duties as well though; not just flight attendant stuff. As far as SERE goes, you'll get a lower level online course at some point to cover the Code of Conduct and whatnot... but you're not gonna get the Level-C slap & tickle course as a Reservist.

[SanDiego]

Hey Hassino, I just came from MEPS yesterday and was fortunate enough to pick up the AIRC contract. The experiences you've given as an AWO sound great and a rating I'd like to shoot for. My questions are currently as an AW dry where are possible places for being stationed? Obviously I grew up in San Diego and I know North Island is an NAS but are only wet stationed there? Just curious on what some of my options may be for duty stations. Also, is it possible to go wet although AIRR isn't in my contract? Lastly, clearly I passed the basic requirements to gain the contract but how much more in depth was the flight physical? Do you know people who have gained an AIRC contract yet failed a flight physical and had to choose another rating? Thanks in advance.

[Haasino]

If you get the AWO rating... which is the most likely option right now... your duty stations will be Jacksonville, FL if you fly on the P-8 Poseidon, and Whidbey Island, WA or Kaneohe Bay, HI if you fly on the P-3 Orion. There are 3 squadrons in Hawaii, but they're going to be moving to Whidbey Island starting in 2017... so ultimately all Patrol Squadrons will be in Jax or Whidbey. There are no AWO's stationed in San Diego... however, we do make dets (Think, few days to a few week mini-deployments) to San Diego from Whidbey for counter-narcotics missions. AIRR is a Naval Special Warfare program, so it's technically always available to you if you want to try to compete for it... once you leave for RTC, however, the chances of getting it go down significantly. And unfortunately, yes, a lot of people get disqualified from Aircrew by the flight physical... some are non-waiverable and have to choose another rating, but most can obtain a waiver... I had to stick around RTC and work an admin job for 2 months waiting for a waiver to clear; I actually spent more time in Great Lakes as a Sailor than I did as a Recruit, lol. They've since streamlined the waiver process though... so you wouldn't be waiting as long as a lot of us did before you if you need a waiver.

[squid.life]

Originally Posted by Haasino

Probably not for Thanksgiving... but you will be able to take about 16-18 days of leave over Christmas/New Years which'll happen while you're at NACCS. This is known as Holiday Stand-down and happens at most training commands... so if you're in training long enough you might get to take it twice like I did. Other than that, you're generally not going to be allowed to take leave once you're actually in class... some commands may let you take leave if you're on hold waiting to class-up, however. As far as weekends go, you're going to have to be Phase III in Pensacola in order to stay out overnight... and you'll need to sign out with a liberty buddy. You'll also be limited to how far from base you can travel... I think it was 75-100miles or thereabouts.



Yeah, you'll be going to VR-61 as an AWF on the C-40 Clipper... unless the moons align and you get one of the ultra-rare reserve AWO billets and go to VP-69. You won't be going to SERE as an AWF... you will if you get AWO. And, yes... I'd say about a year is a fair assumption... maybe 1.5 if you end up waiting for a while to class-up at NACCS or A School.

So, as a reservist, who will join full time as soon as I can, I'm 36 and had to do the reserves to get in. Am I screwed? Flight attendant/loadmaster is fine, but it sounds like AWF is going away from how you're talking. And when I do reenlist after my two years, how will it all pan out? Also are you stationed at Whidbey as well?

[Haasino]

Originally Posted by squid.life

So, as a reservist, who will join full time as soon as I can, I'm 36 and had to do the reserves to get in. Am I screwed? Flight attendant/loadmaster is fine, but it sounds like AWF is going away from how you're talking. And when I do reenlist after my two years, how will it all pan out? Also are you stationed at Whidbey as well?

It is and it isn't... P-3 flight engineers and in-flight technicians are going away as the P-3 is gradually phased out and replaced with the P-8, which only has AWO's onboard. However, the flight engineers, reel operators, ESOP's, crewchiefs, loadmasters, and TSS' on the E-6, EP-3, C-40, C-12, C-130, and C-2 platforms aren't going anywhere. If you get one of the jobs and platforms other than P-3, you'll still retain that billet... your rate is probably going to be changing. Currently, they're discussing the future of the AW series ratings and are most likely going to return to the pre-2008 system where AWO was the only true AW rate, AWF was mostly AE's, and AWV was mostly AT's. This'll let you advance at the rate of the Aviation Electrician community... you'll just be volunteering for Aircrew duties.

And yep, I'm up here in Whidbey... love it!

[squid.life]

Originally Posted by Haasino

It is and it isn't... P-3 flight engineers and in-flight technicians are going away as the P-3 is gradually phased out and replaced with the P-8, which only has AWO's onboard. However, the flight engineers, reel operators, ESOP's, crewchiefs, loadmasters, and TSS' on the E-6, EP-3, C-40, C-12, C-130, and C-2 platforms aren't going anywhere. If you get one of the jobs and platforms other than P-3, you'll still retain that billet... your rate is probably going to be changing. Currently, they're discussing the future of the AW series ratings and are most likely going to return to the pre-2008 system where AWO was the only true AW rate, AWF was mostly AE's, and AWV was mostly AT's. This'll let you advance at the rate of the Aviation Electrician community... you'll just be volunteering for Aircrew duties.

And yep, I'm up here in Whidbey... love it!

Awesome. PM'd you Haasino.

[Haasino]

Originally Posted by squid.life

Awesome. PM'd you Haasino.

Replied!

[ShotOfWSC]

Hey man. IT3 Harmon here, and I'm fresh out of IT "C" school. I've always been interested in aircrew. Can ITs volunteer for aircrew? If so, what do aircrew ITs do, and what can you tell me about it?

[Haasino]

Originally Posted by ShotOfWSC

Hey man. IT3 Huntley here, and I'm fresh out of IT "C" school. I've always been interested in aircrew. Can ITs volunteer for aircrew? If so, what do aircrew ITs do, and what can you tell me about it?

Unfortunately, IT isn't a rating that's able to volunteer for Aircrew. Outside of the AW[x] series ratings, only certain Cryptologic Technician ratings and SAR Corpsmen can volunteer to fly.

[ShotOfWSC]

Originally Posted by Haasino

Unfortunately, IT isn't a rating that's able to volunteer for Aircrew. Outside of the AW[x] series ratings, only certain Cryptologic Technician ratings and SAR Corpsmen can volunteer to fly.

Dang, that sucks...lol. Thanks for the info man!

[Haasino]

Sorry, man... wish I could offer better news. I'd recommend trying to get orders to a VP squadron though, the IT's here really enjoy life.

[bolo]

hey first i want to start by saying thank you for all the info, it's really appreciated. So my question is how would u compare aircrew life to that of another rate? Also between the different aircrew rates which is the funniest per say? I'm currently 25 and have a pretty good job, however i want chance and adventure and feel aircrew is the best route for wat i seek. If u know of any other rate aside from spec ops that also provides this please feel free to give u're opinion... once again thank you!

[bolo]

so i took my physical and somehow didn't score high enough on my depth perception to get into aviation..... so i was wondering what rates would u recommend someone that is looking for a good time and something interesting/exciting? Some things to keep in mind is im currently engaged and will most likely be married prior to boot camp. Also i would love to do 20+ years of service if possible. Thanks again for having this forum and allowing us to ask these questions. Also keep in mindi do understand is all opinion based info but coming from someone that's in is better than reading job descriptions.

[bolo]

just a side note i go on friday to pick my rate so any and all info from anyone on here with knowledge is appreciated. Thank you all!

[Haasino]

Originally Posted by bolo

so i was wondering what rates would u recommend someone that is looking for a good time and something interesting/exciting?

Unfortunately, this type of question is completely subjective... I love my job, and someone is going to have to pay me a lot of money to do anything else... but other people I've worked with hate everything about being a sensor operator. Likewise, there are BM's who love every minute of their job, whereas I would likely hate every day. It's hard to advise on a job based on marriage or career either... some couples need to be together, and others can handle deployment... manning also changes from cycle to cycle, so a rating that's undermanned now, may become overmanned and prohibit reenlistment in 4 years.

Sorry, I know that's of no help... but the military is full of "what-if's" and "it depends'".

[Diverdee90]

So my son went to MEPS today and signed his contract and swore into DEP program. He got AIRC contract and after the AIRC it says ATF can you explain what he will be doing/ jobs... Im just curious because i dont see stuff with ATF info....

[SanDiego]

ATF, if I'm not mistaken just stands for Advanced Technical Field, which is what AIRC is a part of. It doesn't necessary refer to which rating he'll get within the Aircrew community. From what I've learned is he won't know what rating he'll actually receive until he's at NACCS after RTC. He could become AWO, AWF, AWS (i believe that's an option without being Air Rescue) or AWV. It's dependent on his performance, interest, and of course the needs of the Navy. I'm also a future sailor in the DEP program with an AIRC contract. I leave for RTC in May.

[SanDiego]

Hey Haasino, I have a question regarding the Class II swim test. It states that I have to jump from a height of 10 feet and then float for 10 minutes. I have a hard time floating on my back, my legs seem to sink while the rest of my body floats. Do they require you to float on your back for this portion of the swim test?

[Haasino]

Originally Posted by awishbone

Aw man, i was really looking foward to being stationed over seas one day. So thats not possible then with fts ?

I won't say it's not possible, because I know 2 AWF's who are in Japan on C-12's... but it's unlikely. You'll get to visit plenty of foreign countries though.

Originally Posted by Diverdee90

So my son went to MEPS today and signed his contract and swore into DEP program. He got AIRC contract and after the AIRC it says ATF can you explain what he will be doing/ jobs... Im just curious because i dont see stuff with ATF info....

Originally Posted by SanDiego

ATF, if I'm not mistaken just stands for Advanced Technical Field, which is what AIRC is a part of. It doesn't necessary refer to which rating he'll get within the Aircrew community. From what I've learned is he won't know what rating he'll actually receive until he's at NACCS after RTC. He could become AWO, AWF, AWS (i believe that's an option without being Air Rescue) or AWV. It's dependent on his performance, interest, and of course the needs of the Navy. I'm also a future sailor in the DEP program with an AIRC contract. I leave for RTC in May.

^ Exactly what SanDiego said... ATF just means he has follow-on training past "A" School and will be advanced to Petty Officer 3rd Class automatically upon completion of training. Right now the most likely option for him out of NACCS, assuming he's active duty, will be the Naval Aircrewman (Operator) rating, which is a sensor/radar operator on maritime patrol and reconnaissance planes.

Originally Posted by SanDiego

Hey Haasino, I have a question regarding the Class II swim test. It states that I have to jump from a height of 10 feet and then float for 10 minutes. I have a hard time floating on my back, my legs seem to sink while the rest of my body floats. Do they require you to float on your back for this portion of the swim test?

You'll never float on your back... doing so in a real-world survival situation would have waves crashing over your face constantly. The prone float is done face-down, with the back of your head and shoulder-blades on the surface... your legs can hang down below you. Check out the NACCS video posted in the other thread for examples of every swim evolution you'll be required to complete while at NACCS.

[awishbone]

oh! last question, i heard also that for active duty aircrew women people get put on a hold because there are only a certain amount of women put in to candidate school at a time, but that for FTS its even worse? do you know anything about the wait time? or if you experienced any ?

[Diverdee90]

^ Exactly what SanDiego said... ATF just means he has follow-on training past "A" School and will be advanced to Petty Officer 3rd Class automatically upon completion of training. Right now the most likely option for him out of NACCS, assuming he's active duty, will be the Naval Aircrewman (Operator) rating, which is a sensor/radar operator on maritime patrol and reconnaissance planes.



Yes he will be active duty - the advancement to Petty Officer 3rd Class would be after he has completed "A" school and NACCS correct? Thank you so much for answering all questions, it is very helpful....

[Diverdee90]

Thanks SanDiego - he leaves for RTC in June

[squid.life]

Haasino,
Back to your thoughts on your unicorn AWO reservist. Since we don't do go to SERE etc. are deserve aircrew just limited to being on base? How much time do we actually spend on a plane, if any?

[Haasino]

Originally Posted by squid.life

Haasino,
Back to your thoughts on your unicorn AWO reservist. Since we don't do go to SERE etc. are deserve aircrew just limited to being on base? How much time do we actually spend on a plane, if any?

If you're in a reserve VP squadron, you'll have to go through Level C SERE... if you're in a VR squadron on C-130s or C-40s, you'll just do Level A or B online courses. You're still going to fly... you're just not flying over combat zones carrying classified equipment like VP aircraft. VR guys just don't need the advanced level of resistance training MPRA guys do.

[squid.life]

I hate how everytime I want to write reserves my phone changes it to deserve.

Thanks for your thoughts on this thread. Hearing from an actual Aircrewmanis great. Getting a flight suit shortly to take to the pool with me and start swimming my mile in that. I know i know, over preparedness is a fault of mine.

[JesseAW]

Just want to start of by saying thanks for all the info on here, i finally found this site and it provided real info for the aircrewman rating. So my shipdate is 02/05/2015 contracted AW. I've actually grown up and lived 20 mins from NAS Pensacola and been on base a few times taking PST's. I'm really interested in the P-8 Poseidon, If I had my choice of aircraft it it would be the P-8, as a P-3 crewmember what is life like? Do you frequently stay in the US and then go overseas on flights and come back immediately after or do you stay overseas for months at a time at bases? I'm totally clueless about the lifestyle as a crewmember of a non-carrier based aircraft in the Navy. Also, how likely will it be that I will receive training for the P-8? That would fall into the AWO rating which is very common and could I actually go on base at NAS Pensacola and just talk to some instructors there to get info on training and what i should be doing to prepare and also the likelihood of what aircraft I'll be assigned during NACCS. Thanks alot, any and all info is greatly appreciated.

[Haasino]

Welcome! Fortunately for you, the P-8A Poseidon is steadily coming into service... VP-5, VP-16, and VP-45 have already fully transitioned... VP-10 is about to transition as soon as they get back from deployment... and VP-8 will complete the Jacksonville transition next summer/fall. Current forecast is to have the MPRA community completely transitioned to the Poseidon by the beginning of the next decade.

The Maritime Patrol and Reconnaissance community is a fantastic community, and the Naval Aircrewman (Operator) rating is one of the best enlisted jobs in any branch of service... it's also the most in-demand specialty within the Aircrew community, with more AW's on the P-8 then there are on the standard P-3's, and growing special programs opportunities for Operators.

Generally, you're going to have deployment... which is about 6-7 months... and about a 13-14 month Inter-Deployment Ready Cycle (IDRC). Deployments are usually split between 2-3 sites, with additional detachments of one or two aircraft and Combat Aircrews (CAC's) to areas nearby. To use my squadron's past deployment as an example... they were split roughly 50/50 between airbases in Kadena and Misawa, Japan... and sent individual CAC's on Det to places like Korea, Thailand, Guam, the Philippians, and Australia (The latter two being specifically to search for MH370). Other sites we publicly deploy to include Bahrain, Djibouti, Sigonella, and El Salvador... as well as many unpublished places we deploy to which I won't go into. When you fly missions, you're going to take off from wherever you're deployed or on Det to, and then you're going to return to that location. As far as what I can disclose... missions can be anywhere from 6-12+ hours. The P-8A has in-flight refueling capabilities, and is slated to perform 72+ hour missions in the coming years... we're talking about multiple crews onboard though... Aircrew only works a max of 8 hours before we have to be given crew-rest.

While on IDRC, you generally stay at home... either NAS Jacksonville, or NAS Whidbey Island (MCAS Kaneohe Bay in Hawaii is moving the VP squadrons to Whidbey in 2017)... however you may have Dets anywhere in the world... from Las Vegas to Crete... and can last anywhere from 2 days, to two months. Sometimes it's a specific CAC or two who are sent... sometimes it's a mash-up crew with volunteers or aircrew with special skills or access.

Also, you may see a lot of vague info... one thing you're going to need to understand as an AWO, is that the MPRA community is much more than just hunting submarines and patrolling the seas... we do a lot of things that don't get published or discussed. You're going to learn what you actually do as you progress through the 2 year training pipeline; it's pretty cool. You're required to have a Secret security clearance to attend A School and SERE... but it will be upgraded to a Top Secret w/SCI eligibility during your time in Fleet Replacement training at VP-30... so don't lie on your paperwork! Your career is going to be severely hampered if you can't get the clearance needed.

As far as job selection and getting on base... you'll need to talk to your recruiter about getting on base, but the job selection is as follows: You'll choose/get assigned a series rating (AWO, AWF, AWV, or MH-53E AWS) at the end of NACCS... AWO is always the most common... you'll pick whether you want to be P-3 or P-8, and Acoustic, or Non-Acoustic/EWO at the end of A School... this is based on available orders and you choose in order based on class GPA... and you'll receive your final squadron orders at the end of FRS training at VP-30. If you're P-3, you can give your preference of Washington or Hawaii... P-8 stays in Jacksonville.

Beyond that, let me know if there are any other questions I can answer!