Contract Question Aircrew Rescue Swimmer same as aircrew?

[AircrewDang]

I recently got my job changed from os to aircrew, was pretty stoked about it. Only thing is at the recruiting station my petty officer had me sign the AIRR contract and told me it's aircrew? I looked at all the requirements and honestly I can do everything except the swimming. I wanna just go aircrew is that possible?

[jzhaun]

Aircrew is AW. It's not the same thing as AIRR. If you really want Aircrew you're probably going to need another DAR.

Haasino's our expert on aircrew, so you might want to check out his thread about it.

[Haasino]

AIRR is helo Aircrew and classified as a Naval Special Warfare program. Fixed-wing Aircrew is AIRC. Technically, since 2008, all Aircrew ratings have AW in them (AWO/AWF/AWV/AWR/AWS).

Both programs have to go through Naval Aircrew Candidate School, which involves moderately strenuous PT and intermediate water survival training... however AIRR then has to go through Rescue Swimmer School which, as you figured correctly, involves a great deal more swimming and PT.

There was a time shortly after I graduated NACCS that AIRR candidates who failed RSS (Failed, not Drop-On-Request) were reclassified as AWO... fixed-wing sensor operators. I don't know that this is still a policy though... and kinda doubt it given the reorganization Maritime Patrol is currently undergoing.

Tl;dr... you're looking for AIRC, not AIRR. While both are Aircrew, AIRR requires a great deal of swimming.

[Rusk]

They no longer assign airr drops to any aw jobs they get re rated or go undes depending on how they got dropped. I'm at naccs right now.

[Diverdee90]

Haasino I have a question for you, my son is a senior in high school and going to MEPS on Tuesday to take the ASVAB and physical, and get his rating and all that and then be sworn in for DEP he wants to eventually become a pilot. His recruiter told him to become part of Aircrew, what rating should he be looking for when he chooses his rate? Thanks

[LT Guppy]

To be a pilot, he will have to become an officer at some point.
Being enlisted aircrew will get him some exposure to the community, but isn't a requirement to be selected as a pilot

[Haasino]

As Guppy mentioned, you have to be a commissioned officer in order to be a Naval Aviator (Pilot) or Naval Flight Officer (TACCO). This will require either STA-21, or obtaining a bachelor's degree while active duty and putting together a packet for Officer Candidate School. Having said that, however, boing an aircrewman can have advantages over other rates when applying and going before a selection board for NA/NFO because they're familiar with NATOPS, work closer with officers as part of a combat air crew than any other enlisted community, and are generally held to a much higher standard than many other communities which results in competitive packets.

As far as pursuing the enlisted route... the program he wants to ask for is the AIRC - Aircrew Program. It's a series of 4 series-ratings that mostly crew on land-based fixed-wing patrol and reconnaissance aircraft. If he's looking for a Naval Special Warfare program, there's also AIRR... that's Aviation Rescue Swimmer and covers helo crewmen on the MH-60R and MH-60S helicopter.

[Diverdee90]

Thank you all very much for the info that helps :)

[AircrewDang]

So guys i finally got this AIRR changed to AIRC. I thought it was weird when i asked my chief about why I signed AIRR contract when I wasnt even in the Challenge program which is for Spec OPS. I feel a world a lot better since im not the strongest swimmer in the bunch. I leave on the 29th of this month only 7 more days to BASIC. A friend of mine in Basic wrote me recently and said Bootcamp is like DAY CARE. he gained 10 pounds in two weeks. REALLY!?!? Hasbro just curious what happens at NACCS if im a terrible swimmer and I got lucky to pass the Swim Qual at basic.?

[Haasino]

So guys i finally got this AIRR changed to AIRC. I thought it was weird when i asked my chief about why I signed AIRR contract when I wasnt even in the Challenge program which is for Spec OPS. I feel a world a lot better since im not the strongest swimmer in the bunch. I leave on the 29th of this month only 7 more days to BASIC. A friend of mine in Basic wrote me recently and said Bootcamp is like DAY CARE. he gained 10 pounds in two weeks. REALLY!?!? Hasbro just curious what happens at NACCS if im a terrible swimmer and I got lucky to pass the Swim Qual at basic.?

Congrats on getting AIRC! You're in for a long training pipeline (About 2 years in school), but I can tell you that it's absolutely worth it in the end!

As for what to expect at NACCS... check out this thread (http://www.navydep.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5600) for all the info.

[Rusk]

Work on your swimming everyone who gets dropped in class is because of there performance in the water. Work on treading with frog kick and the 4 survival strokes specifically breast stroke. With a good breast stroke, frog kick and being in shape naccs will be an easy time. There classing people up very fast so you may not have much time to practice once you get there.

[Haasino]

Rusk,

If you get the chance, check out my day-to-day write-up and post any changes to the curriculum... it's been almost 2 years since I went through and I've heard it's changed some.

[AGravelle]

My main concern with AIRR is the full process.

For some reason, the Navy decides to make the rate Spec. Ops. Why?

As a born bread water fed kid that lives on the west coast, I want to guarantee that I am the swimmer in the water, and not the door man. How do I do that?

I realize the open endedness of my questions, and I am open to any and all constructive criticisms.

[Haasino]

My main concern with AIRR is the full process.

All Aircrew rates involve a ~2 year training pipeline that sees a lot of Sailors fail out or DOR (Quit) along the way. Even once you get through Fleet Replacement training, you've got ~12-18 months of on-the-job training to get positionally qualified. Is it hard? Absolutely. Is it worth it? ABSOLUTELY!

For some reason, the Navy decides to make the rate Spec. Ops. Why?

We all have no idea... why they didn't just make a helo crewman rating and a swimmer rating, I have not a clue.

As a born bread water fed kid that lives on the west coast, I want to guarantee that I am the swimmer in the water, and not the door man. How do I do that?

You can't... you're gonna be a helo crewman... aka "door man"... for 98% of your career as an AWR or AWS. Unless you end up an AWS in one of the ~3-4 dedicated SAR squadrons, you will carry out the majority of your days doing Vertical Replenishment, Anti-Submarine Warfare, counter-narcotics and counter-piracy operations, and everything else related to standard Navy helo operations. You will also train and maintain proficiency as a Rescue Swimmer... but you're only actually going to act as a swimmer if a pilot or another Sailor ends up in the water. Fortunately, that's not common.

I realize the open endedness of my questions, and I am open to any and all constructive criticisms.

^ Responses in black...

Just to clarify, none of what I say related to AIRR is meant to belittle or denigrate Aviation Rescue Swimmers... make no mistake, you will be elite and trained to save lives. That being said, however, I saw more than a few RSS Candidates who joined to spend their days doing this:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a6/The_Guardian_(2006_film)_promotional_poster.jpg

...and ended up either failing the intellectually-challenging curriculum of AW(A1) "A" School, or DORing because they found out they were going to be spending their days doing this:

http://www.lovethesepics.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/U.S.-Navy-Naval-Air-Crewman-2nd-Class-Bowen-Derik-right-attached-to-Helicopter-Sea-Combat-Squadron-23-watches-the-amphibious-transport-dock-ship-USS-Cleveland.jpg

[AGravelle]

Thanks for the info Haasino. Either way, that last picture looks like the best view in the Navy.